Bad change in SOE

  • Balancing: Europe's landmarks now demand a few more goods and passengers than before (only for new rounds starting on or after 20th of April 2020).


    so instead of balancing the daily prestige from landmark by coming up with a daily reward for those who grind the landmarks , you guys are pushing GRINDING ever further.


    bad game design get got way worse ??



    NICE "balancing" :cursing:

  • It's hard enough selling the idea that the Landmarks are crucial to the region's success as it is...


    We had an experienced player come join us this round who I know well and it took me until Landmark level 6 to persuade him to focus on the Landmark and not to "furn for money the city" or "making money out of new goods in the city" - all things he never would have dreamed of doing on a Classic server where we played many rounds together.


    If it's that much work to persuade an intelligent and experienced player to focus on the Landmark, just imagine how much effort goes into those less savvy? An impossible chore at times and there's no fun in it... :(

  • It takes now already lots of time to fill the landmark.

    A better thing is to remove the city competitions at the SOE scenario. No city competitions are active played until the landmark has it's max level, all to avoid an unintended level up of the city which results in even more goods to bring.

    What I regret the most is that there are changes made without asking an opinion of the players. Just a few German players shout something at this forum and those changes are implemented.

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    If a turtle doesn’t have a shell, is he homeless or naked?

  • I would have thought it better to make changes to improve gameplay (already covered) and to retain new players. I don't know whether you have done a comparison of attrition rates but I in my experience more new players leave SOE (ie abandon the game) than classic scenario, and this is because filling LMs is so tedious. Goes without saying this change will make that worse.

  • The changelog note is not 100% correct. The change is that the required amount of goods and passengers stronger depends on the number of connected players to the city.


    For landmarks of cities with less than 100 active players connected, it is getting easier than before.


    We change this because cities/regions with many active players had an advantage. And it was too difficult for game worlds with few players to level the landmarks.


    Furthermore we lowered the amount of goods needed for landmark Level 2 by 60%.

  • This makes a strong region even stronger. I play a SOE server where no city reaches 100 players. There is 1 region with three strong assos who have now an even easier win of the game. Other regions have 1 big maybe 1.5 bigger asso's. This is killing the smaller SOE servers.

    All changes are made out of the German perspective.

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    If a turtle doesn’t have a shell, is he homeless or naked?

  • Thanks Bruno_BF . I think it really will be better now.

  • Naike ♏

    This makes weak regions with less landmark requirements. (compared to stronger regions)

    And that's good for them.

  • The change is that the required amount of goods and passengers stronger depends on the number of connected players to the city.

    That means stronger regions stil have to haul more than weaker reagons, because they will have more connected players to the cities.

  • Naike ♏

    This makes weak regions with less landmark requirements. (compared to stronger regions)

    And that's good for them.

    not if all the cities have less than 100 players, which we have

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    If a turtle doesn’t have a shell, is he homeless or naked?

  • This makes a strong region even stronger. I play a SOE server where no city reaches 100 players. There is 1 region with three strong assos who have now an even easier win of the game. Other regions have 1 big maybe 1.5 bigger asso's. This is killing the smaller SOE servers.

    All changes are made out of the German perspective.


    Even on German server we never got far more than a 100 players at the end of level 13. The Base of a 100 is not a practical number for a early and midgame feature. I love the idea of better balancing between cities with more or less connected players (I already asked for about a year ago) but it'll lead to much quicker LM leveling on every Server. Thus it is especially an early game feature it has to be less connected players as a basis.



    Sorry for german in the table, but think it's also understandable for not german speaking people. The third colum shows the number of connected players of LM of my one city for every level up of LM form the active and last game. Last one there were abot 220 active people in the dominating region, now there are 179 people at end of era 2 (first colum shows moment of level up). So even the largest regions on german servers will have to transport lesser tons, because luckily or unluckily the LM will only reach 100 connected players in the last two or three levels.


    The base of 100 perhabs is a good base for Endgame Cities, but for an early game feature it is not suitable. I wish we could have had a discussion about this like it was for the new balancing of endgame tons Bruno_BF .

  • That means stronger regions stil have to haul more than weaker reagons, because they will have more connected players to the cities.

    HAHAHAHA


    "stronger" regions will always find a way to bypass this thing , by conditioning the connections to the cities, until level 10 in LM for sure.


    The changes should make this scenario more dynamic, not transform it in a farm or grind scenario.

    The landmark is a great addition to the game , but it is used badly as a design.

    It should be an incentive to haul to the landmark , not a burden


    You are all forgetting that the regioanl points from LM levels were halved a while ago , making the levelling of Lm's even more unatractive


    SOE servers all across the "worlds" have become farm servers for multiple players

  • not if all the cities have less than 100 players, which we have

    The more players there are in one city / region, the more goods must be delivered.


    A 10-player city will have to deliver much less goods than a 50-player city.

  • That means stronger regions stil have to haul more than weaker reagons, because they will have more connected players to the cities.

    no a stronger region with all cities with less than 100 connected players have a great benifit too. Stay out of each others cities or pair cities you will have a max of 50 players. The gap in regional points will become bigger. The balancing should be calculated not depending on active players but tons capacity.

    And as SavageDanyro said the soe are indeed multi player farms and German and Russian groups who destroy the native servers with big money spending faul play

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    If a turtle doesn’t have a shell, is he homeless or naked?

  • no a stronger region with all cities with less than 100 connected players have a great benifit too. Stay out of each others cities or pair cities you will have a max of 50 players. The gap in regional points will become bigger. The balancing should be calculated not depending on active players but tons capacity.

    And as SavageDanyro said the soe are indeed multi player farms and German and Russian groups who destroy the native servers with big money spending faul play


    Thats not right or I think you are not right. Because there are no infos in changelog to the real balancing, I guess the change is the exponent discussed of Bruno_BF in this thread a year ago Anpassung des Anstiegs der zu transportierenden Waren und PP im Verhältnis zur Anschluss / Spielerzahl (Europa) from 0,5 to 0,7. Thus it should be a formula like: (Basic tons for LM Level)*(connected players / 100) ^ 0,7 [old one ^ 0,5].


    Therefore we should get for a example for basic tons on a LM Level of 100.000 these numbers, whereas the percentages are constant through every basis of LM Level tons.


    57053e-1585584344.png


    So there is a better relationship for cities with less connections than before. Instead of the factor of 1,41 before for every doubling, you now have 1,62 more tons to carry for having double connections. But all in all everyone will have to carry lesser tons into LM as my table in first post shows. Even the biggest cities and regions will have to carry about 10-15% less tons to LM than they actually have to. This couldn't be the idea of the balancing.

  • Naike talks about a SoE server with less than 550 players in the game round.


    Winning Region pulls all active players.. 95

    All other regions have someting about 45-50 players


    Now without balancing to the totall amount of players on the servers, this is just a joke..

  • Number of active players connected to the city
    required tons (old) - Landmark level 3
    required tons (new) - Landmark level 3
    10
    31,623 19,953
    25 50,000 37,893
    50 70,711 61,557
    100 100,000 100,000
    200 141,421 162,450


    Some examples how it works. Definitely better for cities/landmarks/regions with less players than before.