Please DON'T do this

  • In Summery:- The forum is to be effectively closed.

    It is to become READ ONLY.

    Discord is not a suitable medium, at this time, to replace the forum and is frequently an extremely uninviting place to be.


    The forum is both a useful resource and and a good place for active discussion

    It is easy to pass over topics you do not wish to engage with. And it is not punctuated with chit chat, greetings, jokes and the weather today.


    People who want information and/or help, should not have to connect to an outside communication service.

    They do not want to wade through irrelevant chatter.

    They do not want to read or to mouse through endless repetitive spam from one or two regular suspects.


    They want to be able to find what they need quickly and easily.

    They want to read others views and to respond thoughtfully and in the knowledge that interested parties will be able to find and to follow the topic.

    And they want to respond in the knowledge that their reply will remain visible for a significant time.


    There is a purpose for the Discord live chat format, but, it can never be a good replacement for an interactive forum.

    It is perfectly acceptable for Discord to be punctuated with chit chat, greetings, jokes and the weather today. This is expected and acceptable in this type of communication service.


    I would suggest that for live and throwaway chat Discord is a very good solution. But it cannot ever replace the forum as an organised and viable resource.


    Yes, I know that Discord can be evolved. Eventually, but not now, it might become more user friendly. BUT, IMO, it is foolhardy for any business to make a drastic change from a working solution to an unknown, and, at this time an unsuitable solution.

    In this world there is nothing softer or thinner than Water.

    But to compel the Hard and Unyielding it has no equal.

    (Lao-Tse)

  • Agreed. I suppose the move is to shift RN responsibilities. By moving to Discord, RN is no longer responsible for maintaining a standalone discussion forum. By moving to Discord when there is a data breach RN won't be responsible since it was not their platform which was compromised.


    The only time I used Discord was for World of Warcraft with the various guilds I played in and/or communicating with add-on developers. However, I stopped using it because it was so hard to navigate and always seemed to be performance issues. IMO Discord is more of a social site not really user friendly as an informational site. For RN it is great place for contests and social activity, not for technical support/assistance. The only time is used the RN Discord was for quiz contest several months back and even then just trying to figure out how to get to the quiz contest was a pain and took way too much time.

  • At least they are not deleting the forum, so there's that.


    But why take this course of action if:


    1. If there's little engagement in the forum, then the moderation needed is low.

    2. Some players can offer to volunteer for moderator positions in order to keep the forum alive.

    3. The forum allows users to quickly find an information using the search function, while also being precise (unlike Discord).

    4. While Discord has been dubbed as the "forum killer", in no way it offers the level of organising and compartmentalizing threads like a forum does. You can think of Discord the mIRC 2.0 and leave it at that.

    5. Last but not least, a forum thread can be found by searching information on Google. This is a huge advantage over Discord, who not only it's not SEO friendly, it's not SEO built at all.


    Please reconsider this action.

  • To the team of my favorite game RN <3

    By banning posting in the forum you alienate and drive even more players away from the game!

    I hope you are well aware of this!

    Once again, we hope you know what you are doing!

    Good luck!

  • If a forum is READ ONLY, it is most definitely NOT a forum. It is a Notice Board.


    Define Forum:-

    1: a meeting at which a subject can be discussed

    2: a place for discussing a subject


    Users of a Forum and users of Social media sites are not necessarily the same people. While there may be some cross-over, the two facilities fill different roles. A forum is most assuredly a must have, especially for new players. A social media site is nice for chit chat, but, is not essential. It is a place for social activity. Many people avoid social media sites.

    In this world there is nothing softer or thinner than Water.

    But to compel the Hard and Unyielding it has no equal.

    (Lao-Tse)

  • I could not disagree more with the idea of making the forum read only. It is the one place where players can discuss issues of importance without having to wade through hundreds of inance and insulting messages. You are once again doing a disservice to your customers And to read that there is no personnel and it is costly is a double insult.

  • 1. and 2. Moderation might be low but no matter how low as long as the forum is there moderation is needed, not only from volunteers but from company officials to prevent abuse of the platform.
    3. Discord also has a search function, yet we do not only rely on discord but on other platforms to store static information like the wiki.
    4. We already have a thread feature and there are ways to structure and organize them similar to a forum here on discord. This is something I already thought about a log.


    I could not disagree more with the idea of making the forum read only. It is the one place where players can discuss issues of importance without having to wade through hundreds of inance and insulting messages. You are once again doing a disservice to your customers And to read that there is no personnel and it is costly is a double insult.

    As I already said on discord:


    Discord will be restructured so this is not the final state of what we'll eventually do. Threads and an index can bring additional structure and split the discussions so you can easily find the ones you are interested in, we won't simply rely on one single chat like now. The knowledge we have gathered in the forum is already being transferred to the wiki, besides that we can use the blog to further showcase static information.


    Also I don't see our honesty about the fact that the outcome and reach of the forum simply isn't enough to justify the time and ressources that have to be spent to maintain it as an insult.
    What I see as frankly unfair is the fact that you expect us to work overtime and extra, to satisfy your wish for a forum that sadly is declining instead of using this time to work for the overall community.

    Die Räder meines Zuges drehen sich langsam aber stetig.

    Wettschulden sind Ehrenschulden, aktueller Kochbuchcounter: 15 Gerichte!

  • Dear Community Manager!


    The Rail Nation Team should not have moved to Discord at all, but should have kept the Forum active and interesting, as it was in Samisu's time on live servers and in Lars' time on PTR servers. That would not have been the case today. It's not our fault, the players' ...


    This is the truth, no matter how painful.


    Respectfully,

    Lacidd23 :):saint:

  • Customer service is always a vital element of any business but is an absolute must in service industries which is essentially what RN is.


    I believe it was Henry Ford who said that every dollar spent on advertising is worth 1000 dollars if put into customer service. He also said only 10% of advertising is successful and wished he knew which 10%. The Wiki, The Blog (and soon, The Forum will join them) are essentially only advertising. (Many people are justifiably sceptical of all advertising.) The Wiki and the Blog do not provide dynamic customer interaction and development. In other games, I do not go to their Wiki for information, I have never read any of their blogs. I go to their forums. Or, I search the internet and almost Invariably I find myself directed to a Forum. I have never been, could never be, directed to Discord!


    With games, Customer's see the Forum as the most important Customer Service medium. They may not go there now for minor information and quick questions, but, when the problem is deeper, the Forum would be first choice. Discord is not a substitute at this time and is by your own admission unlikely to ever be a full replacement. If it is possible to make it fully functional, then, it is important that it is made that way before changing not evolved afterwards. What you are doing is not good customer service. Right now, Discord does well what it was designed to do and is pretty unbearable for your serious players. Your serious players are your long term customers. Long term customers are any service industry's most valuable asset.


    “If you make a sale, you can make a living. If you make an investment of time and good service in a customer, you can make a fortune.” – Jim Rohn, Author and Motivational Speaker

    In this world there is nothing softer or thinner than Water.

    But to compel the Hard and Unyielding it has no equal.

    (Lao-Tse)

  • The forum declined because you many times refused to participate in here. You deliberately held back information only given on Discord, and too many questions by players on Forum was never answered. So maybe people gave up :(


    I have loved Rail Nations since I began playing it in the summer of 2018, now its sadly only 61 days left until I quit the game for good :((

  • Well ... after I read the announcement, I once again thought: why do we see so very few other companies, picking Discord for team and customer communication. They love to use facebook, but why not discord?

    Like almost always google helped. There IS information of companies, who thought about this, but decided differently.


    These are my finds, this is, how they (not me) argued:


    - chat and phone application

    Discord is great for free phone calls, even group calls, and for chatting, for information that can be forgotten after an hour or a day. Discord is great for players groups, that interact in an event or challenge, and never will scroll back to there again. If you create a bug message, or need help, and stay a day offline, you will not easily scroll back to the answer. It's hard to find.


    - no threads

    OK, you can create several channels, but a forum does not care about 1 more thread or even 12 more threads, they can stay seperately and easy to find back, but to do something like that, you create a ... that's how they called it ... a monster, totally confusing.


    - Limited uploads

    If customers need to send us a huge console log (.har), a big picture, or a video, to inform us about errors, mistakes or bugs, or to praise us ... they often reach the limits set by discord to limit amount and size of uploads. So, customers have to switch to some other internet services to store their big uploads, which often contains data about themselves or our company. We do not want such data on servers and services that we do not know.

    We rather set the uploads limits high, as much as our own server allows, so all the uploaded data stays on servers we know and have total control of.


    - direct messages not connected to our channel

    Different to other services or forum software on our own server, direct messages are stored without giving us any control. They have no information to be started from our discord channel/server. This has 2 major consequences, that we do not like:

    a) We cannot protect our customers from scammers. Any scammer can join our channel and manually or by a bot/script send his scam (fake passports, p-rn, bitcoin trading scam, ...) directly to our customers. Fortunately, they cannot prove, that the scammer used our channel, but once the direct message was sent, the contact remains stored in discord and the scammer can continue to use it. We don't want our 9000 customers to go through that.

    b) Same with former employees. Once there was a direct message to them of from them, they are in contact with the customers and new team members (forever). No matter if they left in good mood or bad mood, sometimes we don't want those contacts to be usable.

    a and b) That is the big advantage of a forum: a moderator can delete the scammer from user list, and even delete all the scam before too many customers read them. And sometimes our managers want former employees NOT to contact new team members or customers ... so an admin can delete their forum user entry too.


    - no peer to peer encryption

    Maybe some day discord will encrypt the user to user communication, now in 2021 they do not. So we have to ask our customers not to send private data, and our employees not to exchange internal information.


    There are more ... but they are, that convinced me most, that would hold me back from agreeing full heartedly to using discord for customer communication, other than for small groups.


    But my own main reason would be my lazyness.

    We are in Europe, we have to obey the GPDR and this morning I checked the papers, the many questions, that must be answerd to privacy data authorities, if my company would want to use discord officially for the main customer communication. I went through the form, checked all the questions ... and decided: if my company would ask me to fill out that form, to officially use discord .... i would run. And I would be quick and fast.

    Frei nach Führungscoach Sandra von Oehsen. Zwei Fragen, die sich Unternehmen stellen sollten:

    Was können unsere Kunden von uns lernen?

    Und was können unsere Kunden von uns lernen, was sie gar nicht lernen sollen?

  • We are in Europe, we have to obey the GPDR and this morning I checked the papers, the many questions, that must be answerd to privacy data authorities, if my company would want to use discord officially for the main customer communication. I went through the form, checked all the questions ... and decided: if my company would ask me to fill out that form, to officially use discord .... i would run. And I would be quick and fast.

    Understandable, but Discord is not replacing the support ticket system which is where players would be required to provide sensitive information (Avatar Name, Email, Logs, etc.). However, in part of shifting to Discord they are shielding themselves from liability of GPDR (and CCPA) as when (not if) something goes afoul on Discord it is Discord's issues not RN/Travian Games GmbH/Bright Future since it is not their platform (they too would also be victim of any data/security breach/compromise of Discord's) Nonetheless, Discord and Facebook are no place for support. Social, promotion and advertising yes, support no.

  • Understandable, but Discord is not replacing the support ticket system which is where players would be required to provide sensitive information (Avatar Name, Email, Logs, etc.). However, in part of shifting to Discord they are shielding themselves from liability of GPDR (and CCPA) as when (not if) something goes afoul on Discord it is Discord's issues not RN/Travian Games GmbH/Bright Future since it is not their platform (they too would also be victim of any data/security breach/compromise of Discord's) Nonetheless, Discord and Facebook are no place for support. Social, promotion and advertising yes, support no.

    the forum isn't a support place too, tickets you create at the server you play, not here at the forum and not at discord. The forum is P2P.

    :engine1::engine1::engine1:

    Work for a cause

    Not for applause

    Live life to express

    Not to impress

  • Thanks Lady, great information. However, last time I sat together with a privacy law attorney at a company, he even told us, not to mention facebook as a way for customers to contact the company, Could create some trouble, he told us. So, when I meet him next time, I will ask him. It is not their platform, but they use the service to contact customers, to announce stuff etc. We will not find the answer here, but there are great guys among the Berlin privacy coaches.

    Frei nach Führungscoach Sandra von Oehsen. Zwei Fragen, die sich Unternehmen stellen sollten:

    Was können unsere Kunden von uns lernen?

    Und was können unsere Kunden von uns lernen, was sie gar nicht lernen sollen?

  • What I find ironic is they send out surveys about purposed new game features, yet they didn't (least not that I was sent) do the same about support/community options (Blog, Forum, Facebook, Discord, etc). Plus there was never a thread in this forum asking for our feedback about shifting to exclusively Discord. Instead we are told this is what is going to happen on X date and if you don't like this, 'you're being selfish' (by far the least professional and/or appropriate response made by a company representative).

  • What I find ironic is they send out surveys about purposed new game features, yet they didn't (least not that I was sent) do the same about support/community options (Blog, Forum, Facebook, Discord, etc). Plus there was never a thread in this forum asking for our feedback about shifting to exclusively Discord. Instead we are told this is what is going to happen on X date and if you don't like this, 'you're being selfish' (by far the least professional and/or appropriate response made by a company representative).

    And what is even worse, we are told this is happening regardless of if Discord can actually be shoehorned into some semblance of a proper Forum.


    This change is "Suck it and See" and as such is NOT a sound business decision. It is a leap of faith, and, I, like many others, have no faith in any social media platform.


    By the way, go look at what has been posted on Discord the last 24 hour. Nobody wants, needs or expects any of that on a forum. It is perfectly acceptable of course on social media, and enjoyable I suppose if you like that kind of thing!

    In this world there is nothing softer or thinner than Water.

    But to compel the Hard and Unyielding it has no equal.

    (Lao-Tse)

  • Maselbart

    In Bulgarian there is an expression "You put the cart before the horse"

    It means that you are doing everything backwards/wrong.


    I suggest that in the case of the forum and Discord you do things the right way! How?


    1. First, make a player-satisfying equivalent of the forum(if you can)

    2. Only then turn the forum into a blog (ban everyone from writing)


    Proposal 2: Leave only the German, English and Russian forums open for posting


    If you don't you will suffer another big loss of players!

    How many more players can you afford to lose?!?!??!

  • Really good suggestions "Hear me Roar".


    Sadly, modern society is a throw away society. I, and all those who have been here for years are Yesterday's Customers! So, I am not holding my breath and I am considering my options. Discord is not an "oven ready" alternative. With all the tweaks in the world, it will only ever be "half baked" unless Discord itself dramatically restructures to mirror sites like Steam". Having no forum will significantly diminish this game for me.


    Take a look at Discord over the last week. Moderation there is a "HUGE" commitment! Virtually no significant traffic for several days, and none with any serious game relevance. Moderating that IS a waste of resources.


    (We have several versions of "hi" a couple of irrelevant pictures and a request for a "bonus code". Great fun, if you like that sort of thing. A waste of time if you do not.)


    Customer Care and Service cannot be easily quantified in money terms. They have to be analysed in terms of more esoteric criteria.


    ""I stopped doing the things in business that had made me so successful in the first place, a devastating mistake business owners often make." Tom Corson-Knowles, Systemize, Automate, Delegate

    In this world there is nothing softer or thinner than Water.

    But to compel the Hard and Unyielding it has no equal.

    (Lao-Tse)

  • I'm not on the RN Discord server because I know it would drive me nuts.


    Simple as.


    I regularly contribute to the Rail Nation Forum.


    I'm sure I'm not the only person who is of a similar mind.


    Forums are an invaluable resource where we can come and look things up, have relevant discussions and talk about Rail Nation.


    Discord is just a place for spam chat.